Keep Your Dirty Shoes Out of My Mental House: A Conversation on Boundaries

It’s been a few years since our voices last filled your ears (2021, to be exact), but we’re thrilled to be back on the mics with an all-new podcast flow and format we hope you will love! In this inaugural episode of The SunDaze Journey’s “Unqualified Hour,” co-hosts Alexis Carthan and Mary-Beth Meagher offer their unfiltered, but not necessarily…ahem…qualified takes on what it means to cultivate and maintain healthy boundaries in relationships. 

Whether it’s with a partner, friend, relative, or coworker, boundaries are essential for both your mental health and the well-being of those relationships. Our hosts will debunk a few common misconceptions about boundaries (hint: they’re not selfish or insensitive), and explore how setting boundaries can enhance multiple areas of your life—from personal growth and familial dynamics, to professional success and even technology habits. 

They’ll also discuss how to leverage communication, compassion, and consistency to establish boundaries, built on reciprocal trust and mutual respect. Finally, our hosts will close out with a new segment called “Shining Light,” in which we send love to a person or platform doing the real work to embody our topic of discussion in a meaningful way. 

This week, Alexis shines a light on Nedra Glover Tawwab, licensed therapist and bestselling author of Set Boundaries, Find Peace: A Guide to Reclaiming Yourself. Mary-Beth shouts out Standing Together, a unified grassroots movement that helps nurture common ground between Palestinians and Israelis in the pursuit of equity, justice, and peace. We hope you’ll take some time to learn more about these incredible resources. 

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Transcript

Alexis Carthan (00:06)
I really don't even know how I feel right now. And I was about to give this like super dramatic long introduction, but yeah, I'm just really excited right now. And I'm kind of nervous and.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (00:19)
Me too.

I've honestly been looking

forward to this all week. It just, it feels like it was a long time coming down the pipeline.

Alexis Carthan (00:26)
Yeah, me too.

Yeah, yeah, it does. But welcome back to the SunDaze Journey podcast. My name is Alexis Carthan.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (00:43)
and I am Mary Beth Meagher

Alexis Carthan (00:47)
and we are your humble hosts. And I'm gonna continue to say humble hosts until the end of time because I don't know, it's just been, this has been a long time coming and I can't tell you guys how many times we have successfully, unsuccessfully tried to do this.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (00:53)
No!

Ha ha ha!

Alexis Carthan (01:12)
And, but I feel really confident and I feel really good that this is actually legitimately about to happen and we're just so stoked, man. So stoked. I agree with you, I've been looking forward to this for a couple of months, but I've gotten excited the last couple of weeks just because, you know, we started to put our.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (01:23)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (01:37)
our thoughts on paper and we're like, man, I think we can actually do it this time. I think we have the space in our lives. But yes, a lot has happened since we've gotten on the mic.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (01:51)
Yeah, we were talking off mic actually just now about how it's been since 2022 that we last recorded, which is absolutely wild.

Alexis Carthan (01:55)
Mm-hmm.

20, yeah.

Yeah, but our last thing that we released was December of 2021. Yeah, that's crazy. But regardless, I'm really grateful that we're here. I am grateful for the things that have happened since the last time we've been on the mic. Life looks very different since December of 2021.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (02:12)
2021.

Alexis Carthan (02:35)
I moved to New York City. I've gotten married. I have had different wonderful opportunities and have done some really cool traveling. And I mean, you too, like you literally hiked Mount Everest.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (02:54)
You can tell the people that. It's not quite true, but I will accept those accolades.

Alexis Carthan (02:59)
100%,

100%, she has literally hiked Mount Everest with just like all of the humbleness in the world.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (03:10)
I hiked the Himalayas to be a little more accurate. Everest was not on the itinerary.

Alexis Carthan (03:16)
Listen,

because some of us aren't even, you know, we're not even hiking the mountain next door. I love to hike, but I don't know if I have those ambitions. You and Brandon are like much more cool than I will ever possibly be. But yeah, it's things like that are like once in a lifetime things and, you know, opportunities.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (03:40)
Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (03:44)
But it's cool that after a couple years, we have had those great stories. So anything you want to share? What's been happening with you? What's the 411?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (03:49)
Yeah.

Whew, the 411. Well, I still live in Phoenix, Arizona. That was the case back in 2021, and it is still the case in 2025. But I'm a desert rat. I will own it, and I love it. And we are hoping to...

My husband and I are hoping and, you know, watching the housing market with our eyes on putting down some permanent routes in Phoenix, where our community is and we've just been out here hiking and trying our best not to burn.

Alexis Carthan (04:37)
That's.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (04:52)
since it is the actual surface of the sun. But yeah, life has really taken on honestly a slower pace in the past few years, which was intentional. I felt like I was just running full steam ahead and wanted to make some changes and re-center on

Alexis Carthan (05:04)
Mm.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (05:21)
what matters most to me and as countercultural as it might sound, what matters in this season is the simple life. Those small moments that are meaningful and impactful and might fly under the radar, but really fill my cup and make me appreciative.

Alexis Carthan (05:32)
Mm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (05:51)
for the folks and the nature and the opportunities and the relationships that are already around me that I need to be nurturing instead of looking to what's next.

Alexis Carthan (05:54)
Yeah.

Yeah, that's real. I recently, we're gonna, I promise we're gonna get into the show, but I recently went to this women's like retreat in the city. And one of the things that they talked about was seasons and just like how like every season has a purpose. Like you're never not in a season. you know, it's like winter is your time for like rebirth and like.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (06:33)
Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (06:38)
regrouping and rest and recovery like that, you know, and then like the fall is like more renewal turning over a new leaf and spring is a rebirth. Like it's just, you know, it's so I feel that I like really resonate with that because yeah, like you need those seasons or those periods in your life where you're just like chilling like and it's you're not really like maybe you have spent 10 years like going and doing and

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (06:44)
Yeah.

love that.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (07:07)
and just like chasing after all your dreams, hopes and aspirations. And then like at some point you do have to say like, look, I need to like chill and I'm gonna be intentional about that. I'm gonna try to put my soul and my spirit at rest for a little bit because there will be another time one day where you have to like get back on the horse again. anyway, yeah. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (07:09)
and

Yeah.

Exactly.

I'm always here for your TED Talks.

Alexis Carthan (07:39)
Yeah, thank you. you. No, but that's beautiful.

And I'm, you know, I'm very grateful for you. I always say that. But like, I really am. And because you do remind me sometimes you don't know this, but you do remind me that, you know, like, hey, like, if you need to take a break, you can take a break. Like I like she always holds space for me and my crazy antics. But yes, it's yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (07:54)
Peace.

Aw, thank you, friend! The feeling is

mutual.

Alexis Carthan (08:07)
man, gotta,

you know, I gotta show the love. But anyway, I know like we have so much to catch the people up on and we will this season. We're gonna have all the things all the time. We're gonna create that space for ourselves to share just like where we've been and what's up and like what's next coming ahead. But today, today on this episode, we are discussing

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (08:23)
Good night.

Alexis Carthan (08:36)
relationships and setting boundaries. I mentioned earlier that like I moved to New York and so that meant I had to leave all my friends and family in Georgia, in Atlanta and you know, I started a new job and I got new friends here but I also still had to like foster and hold on to like all of those friendships and relationships back home but

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (09:03)
Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (09:05)
there was a little bit of a boundary problem. I was doing things that were kind of leading to burnout or like stress and just like, you know, not even just like mental and physical stress, but it could be financial stress too, like trying to foster all of these relationships. So one of the things that I had to lean on and had to learn very quickly through the help of therapy and books.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (09:21)
Totally.

Alexis Carthan (09:31)
And just the people around me was setting boundaries. But before we get into that, before we lean heavy into our topic for today, we want to kind of introduce a new format of the SunDaze Journey podcast. So you guys know in the past we have done these like little fireside chats with just Marybeth and I just chatting.

talking about things that we're not necessarily qualified to talk about. And then we've also done our interview styles where we invite all of these wonderful professional people that are actually qualified to talk about the things that they are indeed talking about. So we've done a mix of that in the past. Like one season we did one thing and the season two we did straight interviews. So we're gonna blend the two.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (10:08)
you

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (10:30)
We're gonna blend the two because we do like to run our mouth. As you can tell, we're like 15 minutes in and we haven't even gotten to the topic yet, but we like to run our mouths, but we also recognize that we are not qualified to talk about some of the things that we like to talk about. So we have named these episodes, this format as the Unqualified Hour. So welcome to the first episode of the.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (10:30)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (10:57)
Unqualified hour on the SunDaze Journey podcast where we will be discussing boundaries and navigating relationships. So Mary Beth, anything you want to say to that?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (11:09)
Yeah, you summed it up. mean, think of this as just the two of us inviting you into our virtual living room of sorts for an open, honest dialogue. And unlike our interview style episodes where we'll bring in those experts who can dive into specific subjects or topics.

Alexis Carthan (11:19)
Mm-hmm. Yep.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (11:37)
the Unqualified Hour will be more about just us, unfiltered, no formalities, just exploring life's questions in sometimes a confused way, sometimes a confident way, but you know, we'll always be candid and we'll always have some fun with it.

Alexis Carthan (11:44)
Yeah.

Yep.

Yeah, you forgot chaotic because like, let's be real. Let's let's be real. Like, this is probably going to be a little chaotic, but it's OK. I'm I'm all for the chaos. Hopefully no one crashes out on any of episodes. But I think it'll be it'll be all good. So anyway, let's see how this goes. We're going to kick this off with a little bit of a icebreaker. So we're going to play a game called.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (12:00)
Chaotic too, yeah.

Alexis Carthan (12:27)
the Boundary Buzzword. Yeah, it is. It is very cute, right? It's I don't even know if this game is real, to be honest. It is it is today. It is on this podcast, this episode. So we're going to kick it off. And I want you to share a word and I'm going to share one to related to boundaries or relationships and then explain what it means to you. And if you want to share something connected to it, you absolutely can. But if not, we can just keep it.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (12:29)
Well, that's adorable.

you

Well it is now.

Alexis Carthan (12:57)
You know, so you go first.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (13:00)
All right, well,

the word that comes to mind for me is communication. And I think that is the bedrock of any healthy relationship, be it a marriage or a partnership or a coworker dynamic or a friendship or family relationships, whatever the case may be. I don't think...

Alexis Carthan (13:06)
Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (13:29)
you can successfully navigate being in connection with another human being without communicating your own needs and not expecting them to just be a mind reader. And also active listening, making sure that you're holding space for their needs to be expressed as well. It's a give and take.

Alexis Carthan (13:38)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Mm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (13:58)
And it requires vulnerability and transparency. And none of that can take place without both parties coming to the table and being committed to honest communication.

Alexis Carthan (13:58)
Yeah.

Yeah, that's good. Real good. I think for me, I'm going to go with like coexisting and maybe coexistence. Is that a word? I think it feels good. Yeah, I just I feel like in order for all of the things that you said or in order for coexisting to happen, you have to do all the things you just said. Like, I feel like in order to truly

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (14:21)
Mmm.

I think so.

Alexis Carthan (14:42)
exists in harmony and in peace with someone and no matter if you're at work, no matter if you're at home, you know, with your family, you have to to have like the solid communication, active listening skills and you know, all of the things in order to to live at peace. And when I think about setting boundaries, that's what you want. Like you're not when people set boundaries with folks, it's not necessarily to like kick them.

out of their lives permanently. Like sometimes that is the boundary. Sometimes the boundary is truly like F off. Don't ever talk to me again. I don't like you or you um, but a lot of the times if you're setting boundaries with a loved one, it's just to, to have a, to live on a plane or exists in a way where you can both, you know, coexist, you know, um, live in harmony and peace. So that's what I, that's what I would think.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (15:13)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (15:40)
a little something, a little cheese. Yeah. So where are we, man? Before we get all the way into this, like, let's talk about what boundaries are. I read a book last year and it was honestly one of my favorite books that I've read and probably one of the reasons why we're doing this podcast because it helped me.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (15:40)
Love that.

YEE

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (16:05)
established the boundaries in my life. It was called Set Boundaries, Find Peace by Nedra Glover. Glover, to Tawab. I'm so sorry. I just butchered your name. But she is an actual licensed therapist and so smart. The book is, I can't recommend it enough. If you're someone that has like come from an environment where like you,

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (16:17)
crushed it.

Alexis Carthan (16:33)
always feel pressured to say yes to things. Like I have my family, like we are just, we're just really close and it's hard to, you know, just say no sometimes. Like it's, I think that's just what it is. Like a lot of the times like black women are the glue in their families and like we have to pretty much open our doors, you know, for any and everyone that walks in, you know, which I don't mind doing, but I think the,

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (16:44)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (17:01)
there's a time where you do have to say no in order to protect your own mental, physical, financial health. And this book kind of helped me look at boundaries in a way that I had never really thought about them. And so she defines boundaries as rules, expectations, needs, and desires that help you feel safe and comfortable

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (17:06)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (17:31)
in life and in your relationships. And yeah. Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (17:38)
No,

I love that definition because I think it kind of debunks a common misconception that I've heard about boundaries and honestly used to ascribe to and for that reason was resistant to creating and reinforcing them in my own life because many folks will say that

Alexis Carthan (17:51)
Mm.

Mmm.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (18:06)
boundaries are selfish or boundaries are mean or boundaries are rigid or, you know, fill in the blank, whatever negative stereotype. like.

Alexis Carthan (18:08)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Or like, boundaries shouldn't exist in this type of relationship. Like a lot of the times

people like assume that like just because like, it's a parent-child relationship or even a husband and wife. A husband and wife relationship can also have boundaries. you know, that was something that...

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (18:29)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (18:42)
We can talk about that later, but we probably will. But yeah, I agree with that.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (18:44)
We probably will.

Yeah,

an illustration that I heard used that was helpful for me in drawing up my own boundaries is that boundaries are not fences to keep others out. They're gates to welcome them in, but with terms and conditions.

Alexis Carthan (19:03)
Mm. Mm-hmm.

Yes.

Mm hmm. Yeah, you shouldn't just be letting people in your house, your physical or mental, you know, house just, you know, allowed to do any and everything to you. Like you wouldn't if you don't like people to like wear shoes in your house, like nine times out of 10, you'll be like, hey, can you leave your shoes at the door? The same thing applies to like some of those non like tangible things in relationships, too. So anyway.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (19:15)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (19:37)
completely unqualified to tell you this. I feel, listen, listen, that is, it's just what it is, man. You're not going to wear your dirty stinky shoes in my mental house, okay?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (19:40)
But you said it with confidence and I bought every word.

Alexis Carthan (20:00)
Who gave me a mic? Like, who's?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (20:00)
You

Maybe that's why we haven't been around since 2021.

Alexis Carthan (20:05)
said.

Exactly

what the problem is. No, but seriously, you know, you touched on some of these misconceptions, but I wanted to also talk about the types of boundaries as well. So, you know, in set boundaries, find peace like she touches on these as well. But you can look on a million sources throughout the Internet, you know, and find these as well. So and we'll list some of them in the show notes as we always do.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (20:18)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (20:38)
So

there are a couple of types of boundaries or three types that we wanna hit on. So physical, so that's your personal space. Touch, emotional, expressing feelings, protecting your mental health, which obviously I'm all about, because I keep mentioning it. And then time slash energy, saying no, avoiding burnout. So which one of those relates the most to you or resonates the most with you?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (21:05)
Ooh, for me, it's the time and energy piece. I have noticed, and I'm sure that we could do a dissertation on this as to highly ambitious, motivated women, but lately, the way this has been manifesting for me is...

Alexis Carthan (21:11)
Same.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (21:33)
boundaries around screen time, how I am showing up with my mobile devices. And that's, it's a curious one because my job revolves around being on screens for eight hours a day and then some.

Alexis Carthan (21:37)
Mmm.

Yeah. So you

are you having trouble like put in the phone down at night or just like answering any and everything at all hours? Like, what's the.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (22:10)
Both and. I'll

give a recent example because it's fresh on my mind. My New Year's resolution for 2025 was a bit counterintuitive. When I say it, it's gonna come across as the opposite of what a lot of folks New Year's resolutions probably are. But mine was

Alexis Carthan (22:17)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (22:40)
to stop counting and tracking my physical activity on my phone. That required me to get rid of my Fitbit and it required me to delete the health app from my smartphone. And I have known for over a year now that this was...

Alexis Carthan (23:00)
Mm-hmm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (23:08)
a necessary step for me, no pun intended, but I avoided it because I've become honestly addicted to checking my phone and making sure I'm hitting those metrics and quotas that I've established for myself to the point where I couldn't go anywhere without my phone. It was in my hand at all times.

Alexis Carthan (23:10)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (23:37)
I would even attend yoga classes with my phone in my pocket so that I could track steps during the yoga class. And I felt naked without it. I felt like the day was a wash if I didn't have that constant ticker in front of my face assuring me that I was active enough. So,

Alexis Carthan (23:47)
Yeah.

Mm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (24:06)
It was inhibiting me from being present in my own life. And I knew I had to draw those boundaries around how I'm spending my time and what I'm focusing on and where my attention is. was just becoming all consuming. So that's not a relational boundary per se, but that was...

Alexis Carthan (24:12)
Mm.

Mm.

Yeah.

No, but

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (24:34)
a deliberate calendar I had to create with myself.

Alexis Carthan (24:34)
that's important. Right. No, that that makes a lot of sense because a lot of the times we talk about boundaries and it's like what our relationship outside of ourselves, but we do still have a relationship within us that we still have to protect. Right. Well, kudos to you. I know, like, given your history and everything, like how important of a step this is for you and.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (24:48)
Mm-hmm.

Thank you.

Alexis Carthan (24:59)
You know, I'm proud of you and I'm going to be praying for you, girlie, because, you know, I mean, even us that that don't necessarily have the history that you do, it's it's like we still get like addicted to like tracking our steps and things like that. And like that can put us in a very dangerous cycle and stuff. I know we're not talking about that, but I.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (25:00)
Thank you. I appreciate it, seriously.

Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (25:26)
Yeah, setting boundaries with yourself is also a very important mental and I don't know what I'm trying to say, but they're like they're yeah, like it's something that we do. We do have to do that. A lot of us like we do, but we don't necessarily realize that like, hey, that we have to establish boundaries in this area of our life. It could also be

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (25:27)
Mm-hmm.

No, I'm following you.

Alexis Carthan (25:56)
And I don't know why I keep going back to this, but like our spending habits and, you know, where the things that we do with our bodies and our minds and like what we expose ourselves to and, you know, it's just, yeah, like our personal boundaries, our boundaries from within are just as important as the ones that we use to establish relationships and to coexist with people. So.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (26:00)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

Alexis Carthan (26:24)
I'm going to also say, that my the time and in the time and energy, I don't know why. Why am I trying to say industry, the time and the industry time and energy?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (26:38)
There it is. Time and industry.

Alexis Carthan (26:48)
of piece boundary type of boundary. I relate to that one the most as well because like we were discussing earlier, like being on go and like dipping it and doing it like most of my 20s and now as a girlie who is 31, almost 32. Yeah, like I felt like I was always on go, go, go, go, go and

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (27:08)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (27:17)
especially at work, like I at work and acting at church at, you know, any side hustle, any, you know, contract or whatever it was that I was working on at the time or doing or, you know, giving my time to. I had a hard time saying no, but I remember there was this one.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (27:34)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (27:41)
client that I was working with and there was a girl her name was Emily. Shout out to Emily if you hear this. I'm not going to say where you're from because I don't want to talk about the company but it's a girl named Emily and she was a writer and her and I would work together quite a bit and one day she was just like talking to me about just like the things she had going on and I was telling her like yeah girl I'm like so busy I'm tired. She was like

Well, why are you saying yes to everything? And I was like, because mama needs to make money. What are you saying? Like, are you not hungry? Because I am. And I think that's just like how I operate anyway. Like, I'm just like, OK, yeah, like I'm going to say yes. Like I read Shonda Rhimes year of yes. So I'm like, you know, at that point, like I'm on I'm on it. Like, yes, yes to everything. But I had to learn how to say no. And she she told me that day and I'd heard this before.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (28:13)
Thanks.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (28:36)
But for some reason it is stuck to me and she's like, if it's not a hell yes, it's a hell no. And I was like, huh.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (28:41)
Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (28:46)
I mean, I guess, and of course I went like another year or two, like still saying yes to everything. But now, when I'm looking for my next opportunity, no matter what that is, I'm really looking at it. I'm like, are they asking things of me that I do not want to do or things that do not serve me? Do I really need to give my time and energy to this?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (28:48)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (29:16)
Honestly, I would say 90 % of the things that come my way or like I have probably accepted even in my life, it should have been a hell no. You know, like I'm not gonna lie. think like some of the stuff I look back and like, okay, it served its purpose, but I think I held on to it for longer than I should have because the moment I started releasing things and giving, you know,

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (29:39)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (29:43)
the Lord, all of the space to rain the blessings down on me. I hate to get churchy up in here, but, but I, it opened me up to better and, you know, just more on brand opportunities for me.

Maybe I'm just like coming off of like a nice little break and I'm feeling refreshed.

And I'm like, yeah, like I needed this. I needed this time to like relax and mind my business. when you have that space and that time back to yourself, it really does make you think like, OK, yeah, like I need to start being a little bit more strict about who I'm giving my time to and where I'm spending my energy. So anyway, I

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (30:26)
so real

and it honestly is an invitation to recalibrate and reevaluate what truly matters. Like as someone who lives on the other side of the country from a lot of my friends and family and I'm sure you can attest to this as well, it's

Alexis Carthan (30:35)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (30:56)
It's tough being the one who sometimes has to put the foot down and say, I can't get on another plane this year. I can't give up a week or so of my schedule to come out for this event. I can't rework.

Alexis Carthan (30:57)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (31:23)
my itinerary so that I can show up for you. Not that I don't want to, but sometimes it's not in my best interest and I need to steward that responsibly because there's only one of me and that can sound harsh and it can sound self-centered, but sometimes it's either that or running yourself

Alexis Carthan (31:27)
Mm-hmm. All right.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (31:52)
into the ground.

Alexis Carthan (31:53)
Mm. Yeah.

I am right there with you. know, one again, when we sat down and started talking about this particular episode, the thing that came to mind to me was just that. when I first moved to New York City the first year, it was a lot because we were planning a wedding and our wedding was not where we, it's not.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (32:00)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (32:24)
It was in New Orleans, so none of our family, I had some family there, but very few of our family and friends there, so it was a destination wedding. We were traveling to and from there, we were doing our bachelor and bachelorette parties. We had bridal showers and this and that. And in that same year, we also did our honeymoon. Literally, we finished the wedding, got married, hopped on the plane, had a wonderful, wonderful experience.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (32:50)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (32:53)
came back literally a month later was Thanksgiving. And we made the decision to drive from New York City to Atlanta and spend the week there. And so by the time Christmas came, I said, y'all, no, I can't. I can't do it. And I think it was very.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (33:12)
Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (33:20)
hard for some of our family members to really wrap their heads around like, oh, like they're not coming. Like this is the first time I'd ever spent a holiday, like a major holiday like that away from my immediate family. Like I had never done that before. And I know you can also relate to this because you have, but that was like, that was really difficult for me at first. But then I was like, you know what? We've 5 million, kajillion.

$3,000 million and

Honestly, if someone wants to see us, they can come up here. And I felt like such a mean person saying that at first. But we just spent our third Christmas without our family. it, listen, and it was, it's truly been a blessing for us. Like we've had to tell people like, look, you know,

we can only do one holiday because we do fly back and forth and we go to the events. We go to the first birthday parties and we'll do what we can. But the amount of stress that puts on us, like physically, mentally, and then also like, you know, we're going to fly, we're going to fly Delta. So, know, we're going to fly or, you know, we're going to do a Yeah. So,

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (34:44)
Priorities.

Alexis Carthan (34:50)
But anyway, like, you know that it puts a lot of like, it takes a lot of out of out of all of our banks, like our mental bank or our physical bank, you know, to travel like that. And then we still have work and the actual bank, the actual bank. But and it doesn't matter. Like you can have a million dollars. You can make a five billion dollars a year. Like it doesn't it doesn't matter. Like it does not matter. Like you are still pulling from your.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (34:56)
Yeah.

and the actual bank.

Alexis Carthan (35:20)
hard on, unless you are, if you're a billionaire, you're not, let's be honest. Like you need to, yeah, you're probably fine. Anyway, like, so anyway, I'm saying all of that to say like in creating or in setting in those boundaries with our families, like we have created some really beautiful traditions for just my husband and I, and hopefully one day like our family, like, you know, it's.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (35:24)
You're probably on your way to space if you're a billionaire.

Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (35:49)
It has worked out for the best for us and I have seen it working in the same way for other people as well. not having to put yourself through something that you don't have to put yourself through is like it's gold, man. Like it's like spiritual gold. And yeah, go for it as I drink out of my big jug.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (36:09)
Yeah.

So can I ask you a couple questions to

Alexis Carthan (36:18)
you

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (36:19)
just to sort of parse this out a little more? How did you approach that initial boundary setting conversation or the subsequent conversations to follow? Because sometimes once is not enough, you have to keep reiterating and keep reinforcing.

Alexis Carthan (36:23)
Yeah.

No.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (36:43)
Did that particular boundary improve or maybe even challenge your family relationship?

Alexis Carthan (36:52)
Yeah,

The first year, I think, was the hardest, but it might have also kind of been the easiest, too, because people were understanding and that we pay for our own wedding. And.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (37:10)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (37:13)
they, it was just like our wedding was so close. Like we got married in October. We left and went back to Atlanta in November. And then like Christmas is literally the next month. And I think people were like, okay, like we couldn't do that either. Like, you know, like, like, it like, even if we could, like, it's just, it's a lot. Like they, think people understood in that regard. I think the next year though, it was reiterating our boundaries. Like, okay.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (37:27)
Yeah, not to be real.

Alexis Carthan (37:43)
hey, we're not doing both holidays because it's just like, it's a lot to take off work. It's a lot to like board our dogs or to fly down. It's just a lot. And just reiterating it was, I think, key. And so when the third year rolled around, the question, the only question we had to ask our friends and family was like, do you want Christmas or Thanksgiving? And I think, you know, because we'd already set

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (38:09)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (38:13)
the expectations those previous two years. I think next year's gonna be even easier. People know, all right, if we wanna go up to see Alexis and Cole, we need to, we gotta pick either Christmas or Thanksgiving, because they're not coming down for both. If we wanna see them for the holidays, that's what we'll have to do.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (38:29)
there.

Alexis Carthan (38:35)
Yeah, I think just reiterating and just in standing firm and then it is something that I'm probably going to continue to do. There might be a year where we choose to do both, but it's going to be our choice because it's what we want to do for us. And it's, you know, we're the ones that will be taking the hit in all of the aspects. So, yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (38:57)
I think

you just touched on something major, which is sometimes we have to coach those around us as to how we want to be treated. And I'm wondering if you noticed that others.

Alexis Carthan (39:03)
Mm.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (39:24)
were flexible and respectful in response to you communicating your needs or if you've encountered some pushback and if it's put some strain on your dynamics.

Alexis Carthan (39:27)
Hmm.

yeah.

I think that there have been some relationships where, you know, naturally that happens, right? Like when you tell someone no, and they're not used to hearing no, especially from you, if you've been a pushover, I have never been a pushover in my life, but I have always just kind of like I've had open arms, not a pushover, but open arms. Right. But I think that there is always a level of shock.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (39:40)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (40:03)
to come with that when you're used to someone like always being there. And I guess just being that person that you can rely on to be at every family function, every birthday party, you know, all the things I think. And who's to say that it's not hard because in this particular type of boundary where you're like having to protect yourself in whatever way that looks like. But specifically from

an immense amount of travel or unnecessary travel or just like time and energy. It's it is difficult because you you do still want to hang out with your friends. And, know, you do still want to go to every birthday party and every birthday dinner and like every concert that's in town. You still want to do those things. So this one is a little bit tricky. But I think that. Being having that.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (40:42)
Mm-hmm.

Mm. Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (40:57)
open line of communication and the active listening that you were discussing earlier, I think that that's been like very much key for maintaining these relationships. Again, like this is a conversation for maintaining a relationship that we're not trying to, you know, maybe that's what we have had to do in the past, but like for the purposes of what I'm discussing, I still want those people in my life. It just has to look different.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (41:05)
Mm-hmm.

and

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (41:27)
and so that we can coexist. Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (41:29)
Yeah. I think it's so reciprocal also. Like,

I am always encountering this with the relationship I have with my husband. I am so comfortable asserting my own needs and expectations. And then I conveniently forget that he has his needs and expectations as well. And when it comes

Alexis Carthan (41:42)
Mmm.

Mm.

You forget.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (41:59)
to boundaries, there has to be that free flowing two way street kind of mentality where if I expect to have the space held for me, then I need to equally toe that line for the person that I'm doing life with. And sometimes that

Alexis Carthan (42:02)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (42:27)
is incredibly difficult and it's humbling and it's convicting because I don't navigate it seamlessly all the time. yeah, boundaries are, they're reciprocal and they're a constant negotiation. Sometimes what works for one relationship

Alexis Carthan (42:32)
Yeah.

Yeah. So.

Mm-hmm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (42:57)
is not transferable to another, or sometimes what worked for a season is not transferable to another.

Alexis Carthan (42:59)
Yeah.

And that was something

I was going to ask you, like, especially in a husband, wife or marriage dynamic. The fact that we all like grow and change, like I've been with Cole for eight, almost nine years now. That's crazy to think about only been married for three, but.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (43:18)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (43:23)
In the time that you and Brandon have been married, have your boundaries also changed? Did you enter your relationship with like, hey, this is fine. But then maybe now it's like, that's not OK anymore. So having to reteach and retrain, for lack of better words, how do you guys navigate that? What does that usually look like?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (43:34)
Mm-hmm.

yeah.

Yeah, so we have been married for eight and a half years now and it is wild to think about, but I'm constantly having to remind myself that the person I married then is not the person that I am still married to now. There has been an evolution. So we

Alexis Carthan (44:00)
That's so crazy.

Mm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (44:20)
confront this all the time with our finances. When the two of us tie the knot as kids in our early 20s, I was the consummate saver and he was the quintessential spender. So I just took on the role of monitoring our budget because I was the most suited at the time to do it.

Alexis Carthan (44:22)
Mm-hmm. Mm!

Mm-hmm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (44:50)
But fast forward eight years, he still enjoys spending money, but he's not as blase about it anymore. He's learned and he's grown in that area. But the problem that I've encountered lately is I still treat him as though he's that little boy with a hole in his pocket who

Alexis Carthan (44:57)
Yeah.

Teach me your ways, Branson. Teach me your ways.

Yeah.

Oof.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (45:19)
in my own mind can't control his urges and needs a tight leash with his wallet. And that's not fair to do to someone who has matured in that area. I'm still behaving as though there's been no growth when in reality there's been tons of growth. So he has to check me in that area and just

Alexis Carthan (45:27)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (45:49)
assert the fact that he doesn't need me to be supervising his habits around spending because he's not blowing money that way anymore. If he wants something, he saves for it. He budgets for it. And if it's within our means, he'll get it. If it's not within our means, he won't. And I need to create space

Alexis Carthan (45:52)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (46:17)
for him to live into what I've been asking from him all along, instead of turning a blind eye to the fact that he's doing exactly what I wanted from day one. So I have to be willing to listen to his boundaries in that regard. Like you can't treat me like a little boy. I make money.

Alexis Carthan (46:24)
Yeah.

Yeah. From day one.

Mm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (46:45)
and I know how to steward it. So yeah, that's been eye opening for me. Like, okay, if I expect to be treated like I'm someone who's grown and changed and matured, I need to be granting my partner that same courtesy.

Alexis Carthan (46:46)
Get him, Brandon. Get him, Brandon!

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

So there's a level of trust that comes with boundaries is what you're saying. Oh man, trust, ew. I don't like that. Do you think that trust is earned or given immediately? Like what are your thoughts on this?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (47:13)
Yeah, that T word.

Ugh, I think trust is earned.

I think I'm more trusting than I was as a young adult or a teenager. I think at this stage in my life, I'm more readily willing to grant trust, but if...

Alexis Carthan (47:37)
Mmm.

Yeah.

Yeah, it doesn't take

as long to gain it. OK, that's interesting. I don't know where I stand. It depends on the person. Depends on the vibe, because some people walk in with their Auras and I'm like, I won't trust you as far as I can see. Anyway.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (47:53)
Exactly.

If trust is lost though, yeah, it does depend on the person and.

And if trust is broken, it does take quite an effort to coax it back.

Alexis Carthan (48:22)
Yeah, I'm not ready to talk about that on this podcast because I haven't grown. Like if you truly want to talk about something I'm unqualified to talk about, it's forgiveness. OK, it is truly to. No, I will put a pin in that one. You know, maybe season 45. That's probably when I'm going to be ready to talk about how to get. Yeah. Wow.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (48:26)
Let's spare.

You

We'll put a pin in that.

Alexis Carthan (48:50)
This has been a very enlightening conversation. I didn't really think about, I know earlier we mentioned it, but like the boundaries within a marriage, I didn't really think on that level. But yeah, like I mentioned or just a second ago mentioned that I feel like they can change and they evolve the way that humans do. which is hard because

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (49:15)
Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (49:20)
I had this conversation, I always do this, but I was having this conversation with my best friend, I don't know, maybe a couple months ago, and I was just talking to her about how when you're in a relationship with someone and you start dating them when y'all are babies, when you're in your early 20s and you're out here fooling around, doing God knows what, you're young in mind and spirit.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (49:22)
Hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (49:50)
Like as you get older, you have to forget who that person was. That is hard because I have to forgive your younger self when you still look like that person. know, there wasn't like a like, I'm leaving and I'm coming back a different, like it's truly been gradual. So like, yeah, like your boundaries, of course, are going to change as you get older because you do. But that's.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (49:55)
Thank

Hahaha

Alexis Carthan (50:19)
Again, maybe another topic for another day, but.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (50:22)
But I've noticed that even with some of my friendships, there have been junctures in our dynamic where I've needed some stringent boundaries. And I've needed to constantly reinforce them and sometimes step away for a while and...

Alexis Carthan (50:26)
Mm.

Mmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. So when do you

think enough is enough with something like that? Like do you?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (50:51)
you

I think at least this is the formula, if you can call it that, that I ascribe to. I think that there has to be ample grace because I would want to have grace when I screw up or when I push a boundary or when I

Alexis Carthan (51:02)
Mm, science.

Mmm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (51:23)
overstep, even if, well, whether it was deliberate or unintentional, I'm, I'm going to overstep. And if I'm called on the carpet for that, I, I expect to be held accountable, but I also would hope for a second chance. And because that's my desire, then I need to extend it.

Alexis Carthan (51:31)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (51:53)
to the other person as well. So I think there's room for...

Alexis Carthan (51:55)
I agree.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (52:03)
space and patience to see, right, let's reevaluate. Let's see how this goes. But if it's continual and I'm asserting and reasserting and asserting a third time, a fourth time, like there comes a point where the message is not coming across. And for my

Alexis Carthan (52:13)
Yeah.

Yeah, you get tired. Right.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (52:33)
own sanity, I do need to say this isn't working anymore. It's not that I don't care about you. It's not that I don't have an appreciation for the time we have spent in one another's lives, but I can't continue on this trajectory. Here are my terms. If you can't meet them,

Alexis Carthan (52:43)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (53:02)
which let's be honest, you've kind of shown me you can't, then I am not available to continue on in this direction the way that we've been headed up until this point. And you know where to find me if and when the time comes that you are ready to meet me where I'm at and I will meet you where you're at. So there has to be a

Alexis Carthan (53:06)
You

Yeah.

Pull up she

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (53:30)
certain level of compromise.

Alexis Carthan (53:30)
said

No, I'm just kidding. No, seriously, we've all been there. Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (53:38)
And I've had to do that and it sucks. But and it can be taken so out of context, like the other person can really vilify you in their own minds. And honestly, I can create a story about them as well. My narrative can be that I was totally in the right and that other person was totally in the wrong and

Alexis Carthan (53:48)
Yeah.

great.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (54:00)
Honestly, the truth lies somewhere in the middle, but occasionally we will not, not occasionally. I would argue more often than not because we're the ones we're ultimately stuck with at the end of the day. We have to do what is best for the life we're trying to create and the person we're trying to become. And if that no longer aligns with a certain relationship,

Alexis Carthan (54:02)
Mm.

Mmm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (54:30)
It doesn't mean that the love I have for that individual has diminished, but sometimes reconciliation just can't be an option for even that particular season. It might change in the next, but that's why I keep returning to the word negotiation because I've had to create really firm boundaries.

Alexis Carthan (54:43)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (55:00)
And then I've also had to go back and loosen them up or tighten them up, whatever the situation called for, but it's just, it's an ebb and flow. And sometimes I thought I would never speak to someone again. And a year later, they circled back with a text message that changed my point of view and your relationship resumed in a different...

Alexis Carthan (55:08)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Wow.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (55:29)
capacity because we both learned what didn't work and were willing to try something different, but I don't know if I have it in me to cut someone off entirely if they show me that growth is something they're interested in.

Alexis Carthan (55:30)
Yeah.

Yeah, I'm still working on that part. Now, I I definitely believe in second chances, depending on the offense. Like it all depends on the offense. Right. Like what were these boundaries exactly? Again, this is why we call this the unqualified hour because I still have a lot of work to do. But yeah, I think you're right. Like we've all been there where we've had to like

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (56:02)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

you

Alexis Carthan (56:22)
cut someone off and it doesn't feel good. I don't love the idea of letting a friend or family member or whoever walk out of my life, especially when you have history. Even if there are a ton of bad memories, if you've had good memories with these people, again, this is relationships that you want to save. It's just not comfortable.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (56:35)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (56:46)
it takes a lot of courage to also tell people like, hey, this isn't working, obviously. And we're going to need to like take a beat. We're going to need to pause a second and like, maybe we need space. Maybe we never need to talk to each other again. But for right now, like obviously what you're doing and what I'm saying, like it's there. They're not mixing. So. So I have compiled three tips.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (57:08)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (57:16)
to overcome some boundary issues and things that you can use to just kind of incorporate them in your own life again. Not backed by science, backed by experience.

And just pure intention, the pure intention. The SunDaze Journey is for entertainment purposes only. Disclaimer. So here are a few tips that you can take with you before we dip out of here. So here we go. Number one is you need to use I statements to express your needs. I didn't necessarily come up with all of these on my own. This is research, so.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (57:42)
Just flavor!

Alexis Carthan (58:04)
So you can use things like I feel overwhelmed when you do X, Y, and Z, or I feel uncomfortable when you say this, that, and the other. So that's tip number one. The second is be clear. That's important, but compassionate. Because in my example where I

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (58:10)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (58:33)
discuss like, you know, me telling my family, like, I can't come for Thanksgiving. I was clear in saying, hey, I or Christmas, I was clear in saying, hey, like, I can come for one holiday, but I cannot come for both because whatever you don't have to over explain yourself. Like you can just say, hey, I can't do this. But you I think we do have to come from a place of.

compassion where we're like, hey, this person is used to doing these things, you know, and they might also be upset. Like they might be those things. They might be upset, but you know, you still have to do what you have to do. But in this, it'll be hard sometimes for some people to accept that you are establishing this boundary, but it can get easier. I'm not saying it always will.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (59:23)
Mm-hmm.

Alexis Carthan (59:28)
but it can get easier, hence why we just spent our third Christmas with just ourselves, you know, and it wasn't met with so much a pull, and you know, so that's always nice. And the last thing, and this is the most important to me, is being consistent with the boundaries that you establish, because if you're like,

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (59:40)
Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (59:56)
cool one day with someone wearing shoes in your house and then they come over next week and they're tracking mud all on your white carpet.

and you don't say anything. And then next week they come in with the same shoes on with the mud and you know, like they're going to get mixed messages. Like obviously that's a stupid example, but you know what I mean? Like you have to be clear so they know like as soon as you hit my door, boom shoes, actually take your shoes off before you even get in my driveway, before you get out your car. I'm really leaning in here, but yeah, like I think it is important because

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:00:17)
Mm-hmm.

You are committed to this metaphor.

Alexis Carthan (1:00:39)
people will be confused and they'll be like, hey, but last week, you know, I did X, Y, and Z and you didn't say anything then. And it's like, I thought you were just off of that now. I thought we didn't care about it anymore. And you don't want that. Like you don't want there to be any confusion when you're trying to live comfortably and harmoniously and coexist, you know. So yeah, those are our three hot takes, hot tips for breaking or keeping boundaries and establishing them.

Yeah, this is great. I really love this conversation. I think it was very timely for me. I know for you as well. I think it makes sense, like coming back from such a long, long hiatus. We can't even call it a hiatus anymore. It's just for taking so long to come back to the mic. I think after years of just kind of

going through the motions with all of the people in our lives and fostering new relationships with the people that are now in our lives, it just makes sense because you can use the things that you have learned and the boundaries that you created in other relationships as you move forward into this new version of yourself and this new space that you've created. So I really like this conversation.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:01:46)
Mm-hmm.

Agreed. Yeah, it feels relevant as we look ahead to Q1 of the new year and all the fresh starts that come along with it.

Alexis Carthan (1:02:16)
Yeah.

Yeah, I'm very excited. But before we go, we have also created a new segment where we end the episodes with something positive that we call shining light, where we essentially are giving flowers to people that have inspired us or organizations or resources that have encouraged us, inspired us, you know,

It could be last year, it could be this year, could be this week, whatever. But as it relates to this particular episode, this particular topic, I want to give the flowers and the shout out to Nedra Glover Tawab. I, that book really did change my perspective to the point where I was recommending this book to people that I probably didn't have any business recommending it to. We'll talk about that off mic.

but things that could have got me in trouble. yeah, like, yeah, I, that book was, was really life changing for me because I didn't understand that, like my boundaries don't even have to be explained. I think that was one of my biggest takeaways. Like if I say no, it's a no. And if it's not a hell yes, it's a hell no. Like, so what about you?

Who do you want to shine light on or what?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:03:48)
I want to highlight an organization that I recently learned about back in 2024. And when you brought up the word coexistence, this organization just flashed right in front of my noggin because I think

Alexis Carthan (1:03:54)
Mm.

Mm.

wow.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:04:17)
their mission embodies that so beautifully in a way that if you were to read any headline in any media outlet, you would think that what they're doing is impossible and yet they are making it happen. This organization is called Standing Together and

Alexis Carthan (1:04:23)
Mm.

Mm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:04:44)
I would love to link it in the show notes because it's just so important and it's so necessary in our divided world. They're based in Tel Aviv and they've created a coalition that brings together both Jews and Palestinians who live in Israel and their

Alexis Carthan (1:04:51)
Yeah.

wow.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:05:14)
using that cross-cultural dynamic to do the opposite of what we're seeing in the world at large. Instead of finding reasons to drift further apart, they're unifying these people and bringing them together. And it's creating a movement.

Alexis Carthan (1:05:28)
Yeah.

Thank

I love that.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:05:43)
they're learning how to have honest conversations with one another and see each other's perspectives and hold space for the discomfort and press into the pain instead of pull back from it. And relationships are forming in the most unlikely of places between folks that otherwise

Alexis Carthan (1:05:49)
Mm-hmm.

Mm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:06:12)
would not associate with each other. And it gives me a lot of hope that this is possible in a time that feels volatile and chaotic and not at all peaceful. They're doing the work that is hopefully laying a foundation where

Alexis Carthan (1:06:18)
Mm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Mm.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:06:41)
peace can maybe be attained in a really heartbreaking conflict in a really unstable region. So if that's not the epitome of healthy boundaries, I don't know what is.

Alexis Carthan (1:06:44)
Yeah.

Mm.

And that's that. Yeah, we'll definitely link that in the show notes. I think that's a very important cause, and I can't wait to dig a little bit deeper in all of it. Wow. I love this segment. We definitely have to keep this one up. It's very important to just share like what's inspiring us. That's kind of like one of the main like.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:07:12)
Yes, 100%.

Alexis Carthan (1:07:20)
pillars of the SunDaze Journey is what's inspiring us to keep going and to go after the lives that we want and what's inspiring others as well. It's very important and I love to see what people are in hear about what people are doing out there in the world in our communities and how they're elevating themselves and others. So I love that. But this has been such a treat.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:07:39)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (1:07:50)
I'm so proud of us. I'm so, so proud of us. You are also the other person I want to give light to. I want to shine light on. I am so grateful for this conversation and I can't wait for, you know, the rest of the season and, all of the guests that we'll be having. And just, I always look forward to these conversations. And I know that people are finding them useful because

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:07:51)
Me too!

scabbit!

Yes.

Alexis Carthan (1:08:19)
four years later, however long it's been, we are still getting people listening to this podcast. Things that we recorded years ago is still impacting people and I'm so grateful. So, you know, with all that said, be sure to share this podcast with your friends, family, neighbors, strangers, lovers, whoever, I don't care, just share it.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:08:21)
No.

Alexis Carthan (1:08:48)
you, whoever you want to create boundaries with share this episode with, no, or maybe it's someone who needs to set more boundaries. and we'll have other topics, so we won't just be talking about this. but yeah, go to the website, sundazejourney.com. you can like and subscribe and do all the things on all of your favorite podcast platforms. So, be sure to do that. And, you know, we also open.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:08:52)
Yeah.

Alexis Carthan (1:09:16)
the doors of the church for listener letters and conversations. So feel free to email us at hello @ sundazejourney.com. So did I miss anything?

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:09:29)
Rate, review, subscribe. I think you hit all the high points. And we even have a tab on our website that you can submit your own story if you were inspired by anything we discussed today or if you have a burning narrative on your heart that you want to share and you've been tickled by the writer bug. We would love

Alexis Carthan (1:09:43)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:10:00)
to hear your point of view and what is simmering in your own life. So if that appeals to you, please, please submit.

Alexis Carthan (1:10:06)
Yeah.

Yep. Well, thank you guys so much for listening. Bye.

Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:10:14)
Bye.